Is there a way to regularly auto-sync with Barter?

Yirg

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There are many games in my Lestrades tradables which I no longer have. I don't want to have to remove games from both sites every time I trade or give away a game, nor do I want to manually go over the Lestrade's exclusives and manually remove games. Is there a way to do it automatically, with Barter considered as the master source?

Thanks!

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Yirg

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Re: Is there a way to regularly auto-sync with Barter?
« Reply #2,  »
Yes, the ideal solution for me would be to have the Barter tradables be considered as the master source, where every game that gets removed or added there would automatically be removed/added from the Lestrades tradables list. The only exceptions I would keep (i.e. skip from sync) are games that are I add manually to Lestrades, assuming those are games that can't be added to Barter for whatever reason.

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Re: Is there a way to regularly auto-sync with Barter?
« Reply #3,  »
I keep track of the origin for wishlist items, but not for tradables IIRC (because if you have them on one site, you always should have them on the other site...)
So it's not a magical thing.

The most realistically possible solution would be to synchronize, *except* when a game was found in your list of completed trades on Lestrade's. But aside from the difficulties of implement an auto-sync like this, LT still doesn't have a way to know you actually acquired a new copy in the meantime and added it to BVG and forgot to add it here...

Also, well, having such a feature when Barter doesn't do it for Lestrade's tends to send the message that Lestrade's is a satellite site to Barter, rather than a full-fledged competitor.[1] I have nothing against Barter, but LT was created with the intention to replace BVG as it was failing for nearly 2 months last winter, and BVG coming back from the dead doesn't change the fact that I spent a year on LT's and I'm proud of it, and want it to stand on its own, not as a site that's there as a quick replacement in case BVG dies again without a warning.
Phew.
 1. Yes, we don't have a business model so we aren't 'proper' competitors, but still, one's success will hardly have a positive impact on the other. Or maybe you can also explain how we could both increase our user bases in parallel peacefully, I'm all ears. I've never seen anyone offer to help promoting Lestrade's on other sites like Steamgifts etc., and I'm not the kind of dev who enjoys self-promotion.

Yirg

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Re: Is there a way to regularly auto-sync with Barter?
« Reply #4,  »
I understand your point of view about not wanting to send the wrong message to users, and it makes a lot of sense. The problem is that, as a user, it's difficult to remember to come here every time I update my Barter tradables and click "Remove them all" to get the two lists in sync. I'm bound to forget about it and get notifications about new trade offers for games I no longer have. Like this one, from a couple of days ago.

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Re: Is there a way to regularly auto-sync with Barter?
« Reply #5,  »
Okay, I feel like I've explained myself many times before-- but I need to make it clear again, to everyone who's been using Barter primarily. Lestrade's is NOT a satellite of Barter. It is a competitor, it is not an enemy, both userbases are different, and no one has evil intentions. Those who keep using Barter mostly do it out of habit, and that's understandable. Now, for about a year before Lestrade's was born, I was regularly asked to build a replacement for Barter because of the admin's disappearance, and I said yes, but I also said I wouldn't do a pure clone, I'd do my own thing, with my ideas on top of Barter's. I was forced to open the site to the public too soon before it was ready for mass use, because Barter had stopped working. Turns out that made the Barter admin come back, but I wasn't going to throw away all of my work just for that. So, the Barter admin and I agreed to link to each other on every game page, and we'd be at peace. Most Barter users stayed there out of habit. Half of them have an account here, of which about a half use it regularly. That's fine with me.

Now, these users who stayed on Barter out of habit, they do the same thing I used to do at Barter...
That is, like them, you're used to adding games, and them tag them manually one at a time, reloading the page for each tag added, having to start over and remove all tags if you click the wrong tag, etc.
When you want to find matches across the whole site, you go to your profile, then Wishlist, then Matches, then the Match button (so that's 4 actions), then you wait for 2 minutes, sometimes more, for the matches to show up. When you want to match for one game, you need to go to the same page, and select the game manually from a large dropdown (so that's 5 actions). And wait just as long. When you want to match for a game you don't own (or don't have in your wishlist), you have to add it to your list first, then match, then think of removing it from your list. We're looking at a dozen actions here, for one purpose, which is a single action (single click) at Lestrade's.
These are all part of the reasons why I stopped using Barter. It just gets so tedious after a while. Do you know where most Barter users come from? SteamTrades. And why did they start using Barter? Because it was easier to find potential trades. Lestrade's is the next logical step, making it as easy as possible to do that. It doesn't have SteamTrades's 100.000 active users, or Barter's 1200, but that's okay, it still works, I've done 60+ trades in 4 months here, and I've been too busy to send offers like when I was on Barter and didn't have Lestrade's to work on. I built LT with the idea that it would be the next step for hardcore BVG traders like me who just couldn't cope with the slow matching anymore. That's why users all get a nice big 'Matches' button on every page. You click it, and a second later you get a page with all your matches. Then you find a potential trade, and you start thinking, "okay, out of those 2 possible games of mine, is there one I can get more easily..?" So you start pressing the 'Takers' link on both game pages, find more possible trades, then it helps you determine which game you'll offer to whom. Feeling restrained with a 1:3 offer you're sending? You can send a second, even a third offer to the same user, with a 1:2 ratio and different games. User gets to choose which configuration they prefer, accept that, and decline the others.
If you ask me, that's just fantastic. Instead of being a chore, trading became a fun hobby again for me.

Okay.

Now that we've established all of this, you're posting here, taking some of my time to ask for me to implement a way to automatically sync your lists, because it's too hard to press a button and wait for a couple seconds, when everything at Lestrade's is instantaneous, and built for your enjoyment.

Hmm.

Maybe you could simply press 'Decline' when you get a dummy offer.
You've been there a few months, you received a total of 7 offers, not all of them for outdated tradables (in fact, ALL of them were fair and balanced offers!), and each time, all you had to do was to click 'Decline' and move on. It should have taken about one minute of your life overall... Maybe 2 minutes if you also took the time to click the outdated tradable's name, then press 'Remove' on the Tradable line.[1] Apparently, my work on making things easy to use is not fully appreciated. That's fine. Let's say you don't want to waste 5 seconds every other week on a dummy offer. Let's compare apples with apples. How many unbalanced offers do you receive weekly on Barter..?[2] Do you complain to the Barter admin when you receive those, too..? I'm just curious.

Or, if you wanted to save time and energy, you could choose to make Lestrade's your main base of operations (or at least use it equally as much), and invite all your friends to it. You certainly wouldn't be the first to enjoy the improved features here. But if you choose to remain on Barter mostly, I'm not going to judge, but don't try to convince me that you're not enjoying making your trading life more *complicated*. In fact, if you don't enjoy pressing a button every once in a while, and want even more automation, then I don't know what you're doing at Barter. I would expect you to be asking for me to make the whole process more complicated... Like, adding a 2-minute delay to the import tool. Again, I'm not judging.

I'm open to suggestions, but this one, while technically perfectly doable, just doesn't make sense for me in the current context, with you asking, and me being on the receiving end.
 1. Remember, Barter requires you to go to your tradables, find the game, and remove it from there. Oh, and you have to be in Edit mode. You can't do both, because otherwise it would be an easy site to use.
 2. I just checked; just yesterday you got offered Overcooked for Batman Telltale... Yeah, not balanced. In fact out of 11 offers you declined this last month, 7 were arguably unbalanced. And the one offer you sent was also very unbalanced. So you know how easy it is to send unbalanced offers. The reason you've been getting balanced offers at Lestrade's is that it's easier for everyone to build fair offers, and generally everyone is well behaved. I'm preaching for my own, of course, but that's my overall feeling. One that helps me keep working on the site, hoping to make it even better by the day.

Yirg

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Re: Is there a way to regularly auto-sync with Barter?
« Reply #6,  »
Thanks for the detailed reply. For some reason I thought Lestrades was still in beta, so I didn't really consider making it my primary trading site, but you know what? I'm open to this option. What would you suggest as the best way to experience the site? Clear out my Barter tradables and switch completely to Lestrades for a "clean" evaluation period, or something less extreme? I'm not dependent on trading in any way, so am willing to give the first option a fair shot.

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Re: Is there a way to regularly auto-sync with Barter?
« Reply #7,  »
Quote from Yirg on August 7th, 12:13 AM
Thanks for the detailed reply. For some reason I thought Lestrades was still in beta,
It never was in 'beta', although you can consider it went out of it in early May, when I announced that Lestrade's was on feature parity with BVG. (It wasn't completely, but all of the 'big' features were there at that point.)
Quote from Yirg on August 7th, 12:13 AM
so I didn't really consider making it my primary trading site, but you know what? I'm open to this option.
Thanks ;)
Quote from Yirg on August 7th, 12:13 AM
What would you suggest as the best way to experience the site? Clear out my Barter tradables and switch completely to Lestrades for a "clean" evaluation period,
You don't need to clean up your BVG tradables, you can simply set your account to inactive and you won't get offers.
(I'll also eventually add an 'inactive' status to LT's, I just need to rewrite the profile area to allow for custom settings to be shown. I just hate writing UI...)
Quote from Yirg on August 7th, 12:13 AM
or something less extreme? I'm not dependent on trading in any way, so am willing to give the first option a fair shot.
I wouldn't disable anything personally; even my BVG account is still active. I simply decline all offers I receive. In case I receive a really great offer and the sender isn't on LT's, then I'd accept it, but it hasn't happened once since I left BVG officially.

I'm hoping to launch a new feature around next week that should help grow the user base. For how long, I don't know, we'll see.